Shero Cafe Podcast

026 Fostering Authenticity and Ethical Leadership

• Deborah Edwards and Debbie Pearson

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Has it ever been difficult for you to make a decision? Let us know what your challenge was by clicking the link above.

In this episode, we uncover the secret to mastering the art of decision-making without being overwhelmed by stress. We tackle real-world scenarios, like the dilemma of whether or not to even purchasing a laptop amidst political and economic uncertainties, and reveal how staying informed and flexible can help you make thoughtful choices. Explore how to maintain a calm mindset, avoid fear-driven decisions, and align your actions with your personal and professional goals.

Join us as we explore the creation of communities rooted in trust and support, particularly in leadership courses and workshops. We discuss the unique challenges professionals face in group settings and how to foster an environment that is both safe and authentic. By promoting emotional intelligence and self-awareness, we lay out strategies to cultivate spaces where trust can flourish, allowing meaningful contributions while upholding privacy and respect.

Our conversation delves into the transformative Self-Sustaining Leadership (SSL) program, focusing on authenticity and ethical behavior. Discover how SSL equips individuals with the tools for self-validation, encouraging a shift from external approval to inner empowerment. We share insights on embracing self-love, establishing healthy boundaries, and living in the present moment, all of which contribute to personal growth and resilience. Tune in to learn how these concepts can enhance your leadership journey and personal well-being.

---CONNECT with Shero Cafe---
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/shero.cafe.podcast/
Email: thesherocafe@gmail.com

---CONNECT with Deborah Edwards---
Let's Connect on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/deborah.edwards.372
Self Care Community: https://www.facebook.com/groups/624202641785785
Website: https://gratefulom.life/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deborahedwards-selfcarecoach/


---CONNECT with Debbie Pearson---
Facebook (personal): https://www.facebook.com/debbie.pearson.921
Facebook Group (Creative Self-Discovery Lab): https://www.facebook.com/groups/creativeselfdiscoverylab
Website: https://www.debbiepearson.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debbiepearsoncoach/

Debbie:

okay, yeah, what were we saying about? If there's an issue and we're stressing about the current situation, the political climate, how to handle it, and I said something like I'm making it like a little slogan stress less, plan more. But in reality, what does that mean for each individual in each moment? So go ahead and finish what you were saying.

Deborah:

So what I was saying? You know, stress less, plan more. I say stress less, don't plan for anything until it's happened, because you don't know what it's going to look like. So you can be spending all the and this is an example of something that happened today.

Deborah:

So patrick and I were thinking about well, I'm going to get a laptop, I'm going to get a new laptop, and there has been some talk that, you know, with these tariffs, there's going to be an increase in prices and da, da, da, da, da da. And so I'm, you know, I'm going to buy my laptop. Now there's people saying buy those big ticket items now because they're going to cost more in the future. Well, the tariff hasn't happened, nothing has happened yet. And so if I start planning to buy things now, squirreling away my laptops and all of this stuff now because of what I think might happen in the future, if it doesn't happen in the future, then I've spent all this money that I didn't necessarily need to spend.

Deborah:

So, for me personally, I need a laptop anyway. I was looking at a laptop anyway. But we're trying to avoid making decisions now based on something that we think might happen in the future but has not happened and may not even happen in any way, shape or form close to that. You know there's a lot of things we don't know, so it's hard to plan for the you know, the you know the end game that keeps moving and shifting.

Debbie:

Okay, I'm really glad that you said that, because in my mind, that's what stress less, plan more means, instead of going oh my God, what do I do? What do I do? Should I buy it? Should I not buy it? The plan is to be consciously aware of where we are. He hasn't even made it into office yet. Right, I rush out to buy it right now. No, I'm planning to not do that.

Debbie:

It's more like when I say stress less, plan more. It's like a cute little saying because it's easy to remember. It's like to be cognizant of what's happening. Is this something I want to do right now? Is this something I need to maybe put on my calendar for two months from now, january 15th? You know how? How is it looking? You know who else has been nominated into the cabinet? Um, what else is going on that I may need to pay attention to? So maybe the word plan is a trigger, because I'm hearing you say execute the plan. How do I execute the plan? Well, to me it's like we, we can.

Debbie:

It's a matter of not allowing the anxiety to take over the limbic system by by focusing on what you can or may not be able to do, either in the moment or in the near future, as opposed to just, you know, just constantly freaking out but not really thinking about what's possible, thinking about what you might. I mean like if I was a person that was going to say I was undocumented, I really shouldn't be here. I know I shouldn't be here. I have choices. I can go back, I can hide. I really shouldn't be here. I know I shouldn't be here. I have choices. I can go back, I can hide, I can try to run away, I can hope they don't find me. But to me those are all just kind of like wide open ended and very stress related, because maybe I don't want to go back, maybe I don't want to hide, maybe I want to continue to live my life. So there's all these things, but it's like the plan part is take a good hard look at what's happening, make some decisions about it.

Debbie:

Yeah, go ahead does not interest me in any way, shape or form. So my focus is more on not just the individual, but helping the coach, the entrepreneur, the business owner with moving to that next step. This is the leadership thing. The reason that I'm saying it that way is because I find that individuals don't care who they're in the room with, but professionals don't want to be in the room, or the group I'm saying the room meaning the Zoom room with potential clients or with actual clients, and so there's, it's kind of like the professional and the non-professional, and maybe I need to kind of classify it like that. Maybe I need to say the individual and the non-professional and maybe I need to kind of classify it like that. Maybe I need to say the individual and the business owner or something like that, because I've just heard it so many times by especially what are you going to say?

Deborah:

Because I can see that you're like wanting to speak something well, I think that when you know that the individual has to have that ability to be able to be a part of the group, so to have that self-awareness, to have all of that, I think that the um, the, the strength and the emotional intelligence of the individual is what makes up the group. So, when I'm thinking about whether you know, either stress less and plan more, what that brings up for me is for each of the individuals within that group to create a community or an atmosphere that allows for each of the individuals within that community to react less and respond more. So, responding to what's right in front of you right now, you know, because when we're reacting, we're reacting to all of these stimuli, many of which, most of which we have no control over, and your response may be just to say you know, I don't have any control over that, I'm not going to stress over that.

Debbie:

You're bringing up something that I kind of had thrown out the window, unconsciously, without thinking, because I'm reacting to some things that I've heard. I've worked with a few therapists and trying to talk to them about the skills that are taught in SSL, that are taught in SSL and, you know, invited them to to workshops and to the course when it's starting like a personal leadership course. They don't need to become a coach, they already are one, you know. But they're like I don't want any of my clients being in there because I don't want to be in there in that group with the client. But here's the thing, just what you're talking about group with the client.

Debbie:

But here's the thing, just what you're talking about the mentality of our world is such that they have to protect themselves because there's not trust in the ability of the client to be able to keep their mouth shut if the therapist or whatever says something that, like they would have to guard themselves. But to create the community we want to create means being a little bit vulnerable, understanding that everyone that comes into the SSL community and I'm just going to call it that for now but that group, that community, is saying I am going to keep my mouth shut. I am not going to expose anyone who's having an issue or a problem I don't even care if it is my therapist or whatever that that person should feel safe, because the people we're bringing in are ready to be ethical, are ready to be authentic and have integrity as opposed to something else and I don't know.

Debbie:

I feel like I'm not really getting it out well, but I'm hoping you understand what I'm meaning.

Deborah:

And for our listeners, I'm going to take a moment here. Debbie keeps referring to SSL and what that is is health sustaining leadership. It's a program, it's a coaching system program and Debbie is heavily involved with that. Can you just kind of give our listeners a definition? Just a quick definition of what, because you keep referring to SSL.

Debbie:

Yeah, sorry about that, it's just so ingrained, it's just like fundamental to me to say it like that. So SSL is short for self-sustaining leadership, and it's a way, it's a model, it's a way by which to live, a philosophy to live your life so that you are more authentic, more, have higher integrity, you're more ethical, more moral, and it's a skills-based but done in a very, very specific manner that is so conducive to your brain. Understanding, I like to. It is so much of our leadership. Different ways of being are using the right brain and, nope, the left brain, sorry, very logical brain, and it's got to be this way. And you know, you got to do this thing.

Debbie:

And it's challenging because there's a lot of us, especially that, the entrepreneurial person, the one who has their own business. We're more right brain, we're more creative. I don't want to follow all those. We're more right brain, we're more creative. I don't want to follow all those old rules and paradigms. Right, I want to be able to be more free, to be more fluid within my company or whatever it is I'm doing with my clients, as opposed to the rigidity of big business. So we go into business for ourselves, but then we get stuck. So we go into business for ourselves, but then we get stuck and for the most part, we end up with some feeling of maybe I'm not good enough, I'm not important, I don't value myself. There's some disempowering belief that we're living with, thinking that we can't do or be more.

Debbie:

And self-sustaining leadership, or SSLL, is a program that gives us the tools that we probably never learned in home school, any other job we've ever had, so that we can become more aware of ourselves. We're taught to look out there to everybody else, right, which, you know, is that person? Okay, who do I need to take care of? How do I need to function in this so that people like me? I want to belong and I want to connect. So we're always looking out there as opposed to looking inside of ourselves, and so the program is teach it. Teaching us literally new neural pathways, literally new neural pathways. How do I take care of me? How do I love me? Not in an egotistical way, but in an emotionally healthy way. So I know you said a brief. I don't know that that was brief, but that's essentially what it is it is. You know, I've heard people say, oh, my God, if only I had known, and I was one of those people too.

Debbie:

I'd spent my life seeking, searching for something, something. What is missing in my life? What is missing in my life? Something's missing in my life, unless I was like in the midst of falling in love. Then it felt like my life was complete. But the minute you get to that point where you start doing your own things and they I don't know get busy with a game, a book, a friend, whatever, and it's like why aren't you paying attention to me anymore? It's like my drug was taken away and all of a sudden I have to face myself again. With who am I? So? I feel dismissed if I feel unappreciated. Why is that? What is going on there? And the program is about learning the skills so that when those things come up, you're able to take care of it on your own and you're able to figure it out on your own, and you don't need the other person to validate you. But I want to be clear you don't need them to, and it's always wonderful when they do.

Deborah:

Right.

Debbie:

It's the difference between I can, in a healthy way, validate myself and be fine versus, oh my gosh, I'm dependent on another to validate me. And if they don't validate me, what do I need to do differently, you know? Do I need to cook better meals? Know, do I need to cook better meals? Do I need to lose weight? Do I need to, like, wear high heel shoes? Do I need to wear more makeup? And that there's this desperation that comes with that, where the anxiety begins to grow and grow, and grow, because I can't figure it out. And the reason why we can't figure it out is because it's not out there.

Debbie:

The way I like to show it without, I know, no one can see us is if you turn your head all the way to the left over your left shoulder and look back as far as you can see, and then you scan, you turn your head all the way to the right and you look far over your right shoulder as far as you can see. That's a lot of stuff and you know all that information, everything you can see. It's like you got it. It's all that's information and you are understanding. But the part that you don't know is like right behind your neck. It's the part that you just can't see.

Debbie:

So SSL, or self-sustaining leadership, shows you how to begin with yourself, so that and you lead yourself right. So it's, it's sustaining your own leader, your own self-leadership, cause we're all leaders, whether we think we are not. We lead ourselves all day, every day. But it's being able to find those parts that we didn't know and then put those into play in our lives, and the difference I, the difference that I have had just in a few years, is just phenomenal. And I was with the class last night. They're one year in and they're looking back saying I cannot believe that I've gotten this far. So it's a, it's a wonderful program and it works. And there's, you know, scientific proof, and what's that? There's another word Empirical. Yeah, empirical proof. So is that what you're going to say, empirical, or were you going to say something else?

Deborah:

No, that's fine, that's good, and and and and. Really this conversation isn't a commercial. And really this conversation isn't a commercial. I swear for self-sustaining leadership. That is just one way, that's just one path, and both Debbie and I have been involved with self-sustaining leadership to some degree Debbie more than me so that there's kind of a mutual understanding with us. But the key is to look inside yourself or wherever you are. Look inside yourself and not outside of yourself, to allow yourself the space to respond rather than react. So the stress and anxiety that comes up with your as you navigate through these things that are happening are creating a reaction rather than a response.

Debbie:

Yeah, and we live so much of our lives in reaction and we don't even realize it it's. You know, our brains are designed to create patterns and then store the patterns. So if you think about so many things you do in your life your breakfast, fixing it, I mean, maybe you have to think what am I gonna eat? But the minute you go, oh, a scrambled egg, you don't really need to think about it. You know you're gonna pull out the pan and the spray or the butter or the whatever and the eggs, and you're gonna. You're just gonna do that thing same with, you know, brushing your teeth or tying your shoe, getting dressed, whatever you. You form a pattern, a habit. It becomes an automatic behavior. You don't really need to think about it, although you can shift it, like put your toothbrush in the other hand. That's so weird, right? Um? But how much of our lives do we actually just follow the automatic behavior, patterns, habits, thoughts, reactions? It's like there is no thought about it. It's so ingrained in what we do and a lot of times associated with either our family or our culture or a religion or some other group of people, that there's a fear and a lot of it is fear driven. If we don't act a particular way, say a particular thing, perform in a particular way, we will be maybe ostracized, rejected, and there's such fear in that, and it's a lot because of what you said. We're not going within ourselves, we're depending on our worth to be given to us by others, and that's where we actually get in trouble. That's where pain comes from, because we can't force other people to give us what it is that we think we want or feel like we want. And so if, say, I dress a particular way because I feel like I need compliments to feel validated and special, and I dress myself up and I go there and nobody compliments me, oh my gosh, what's going to happen? Right, I'm going to have a terrible evening Like why come, nobody complimented me. But if I get dressed and I take a look at myself from the inside out and I go, you know I like the way this feels on me. I'm comfortable, like this.

Debbie:

One quick example is I chose to take off high heel shoes and put on tennis shoes. They were gold, sparkly tennis shoes, you know, very shiny, but I chose it intentionally for myself. And when I got to the place where I was going to go and I was performing on. You know, do my speech? I didn't get a lot of. Oh my gosh. Know, do my speech? I didn't get a lot of. Oh my gosh, I love your tennis shoes. I didn't get a lot of that and I was a little, a little bit intimidated. And yet my people, when they see my video of my speech and they're like, oh my God, I love your shoes and good for you for having the confidence for wearing them instead of high heel shoes, because it really called for that. Oh, professional, professional, dress up, with the suit and jacket and everything. But you know what, when I wore the tennis shoes, I felt more myself, which made me feel more confident in what I was going to say and in the speech I was going to give. And that was magic. I did not need them to approve them, meaning the people I was with, I did not need them to approve my outfit. But that's only a recent development, recent in the last couple of years. Before now, I would have been what's the right thing to wear in order for them to accept me and I watched them go through this process.

Debbie:

One lady had the high high heels. They're probably four inch heels, but they were like little booties, they were cute and right before she stepped on stage she put them on and she got on stage and she did her thing and she did her talk. She's probably talking for 15, 20 minutes. The second, the cameras were off, she ripped those boots off her feet and she was like, oh God, my feet are killing me. And I just was like mine aren't.

Debbie:

I didn't say those words to her, but I recognized I was being true to myself. That's authenticity, right, being true to yourself. I was being true to myself. That's authenticity, right, being true to yourself. And I allowed myself to feel the most comfortable that I could feel for me, as opposed to worrying about what those other people were thinking or whether I should or shouldn't wear those tennis shoes or whatever. And it was just the best. This is the best comfortable speech I feel like I've ever given, because I just was so comfortable in my skin and in my shoes.

Debbie:

But, uh, yeah, it was very important to me to have that experience, um, and and it solidified for me all of what we're talking about when you truly know yourself, when you're clear about who you are and you've got to, you got to go through some things right, you got to break some patterns down. We've been, we've been piling these patterns, these repetitive patterns, on ourselves for what? 40, 50, 60, 70 years? That's decades, people, decades, right? So it's going to take a minute to unravel some of that. Some will unravel quickly, other parts take a little longer, but the onion will get peeled, those layers will come off if you're committed to yourself and you keep working it. And that's the beauty of going within and figuring out who you are. So, yeah, kind of got off on a tangent there, didn't I? But yeah, I truly believe that Every ounce of my being, every word of it I'm just staring at me so quietly. Do you have something to say?

Deborah:

I have a lot to say.

Debbie:

Okay, all right, people, here it comes. I have a lot to say. Okay, all right people.

Deborah:

Here it comes. Yeah, well, one of the things that I'm what I'm I'm thinking about, like I guess what there's? There's two things that that I'm thinking about, right, so self-love, that's when you're looking inside of yourself and taking, having that awareness of how you want to be in each moment and building yourself up and just creating in your being the authenticity connecting to what resonates to you as who you are. And then I'm looking at the self-care end of it too, right.

Deborah:

So me looking at these different um things, that these different things that happen in our lives, um, and saying, okay, how do I want to be in this moment? Right, and? And so there's the inside, the self-love, the self-awareness, the level of consciousness, and there's also the practical side of how am I going to be in this moment, can you share more of what you mean how I'm going to be in this moment, just so people are clear about what you mean by that well, I think it's pretty self-explanatory.

Deborah:

Um, you know, like, how am I going to be in this moment? Am I going to allow myself to be full of anxiety? Am I going to be calm in this moment? Am I going to be loving in this moment? Am I going to be judgmental in this moment? Am I going to be? You know, there's so many things that we can be in that we can be. Am I going to be grateful in this moment? And so the decision that you make about this very moment, it doesn't have to be going okay, I'm going to be grateful in this moment. But there's a, a way of being that you've created through your self-care and self-love that will kind of dictate the way that you're going to be in this moment. And a lot of times we, many of us, react to moments without because we have a lack of self-awareness and a lack of self-care that allows us the space to create what we want in each of these moments. So that's what I mean about how I want to be.

Deborah:

Again, I think I've mentioned many times before that stop method, where you just stop, take a breath, observe, look around. You know, decide what's going on. You know, am I really upset about what's actually happening right now? Or am I upset about what happened to me 10 years ago? Or am I upset about what I think might happen in the future, which what we want to do? Just having that awareness. Okay, now I need to get myself back in the present moment and address how I am right now. I am fine. There is no threat. I don't need to stress, I can just be calm with that.

Debbie:

So I think you brought up a really, really, really good point and I want to just focus on when we are looking in the past or looking in the future. We just have no control over it, right? Yes, it can affect us, like we might get triggered by something somebody just did, but if we sit with it for a few minutes is in the present moment. We may look and see, oh my gosh, my mother, father, sister, brother, whatever used to do that, and maybe it was imposing themselves on my time or my energy or whatever it was. You know, brother, tricking, lying, tell mom and dad I did it versus they, then them, whatever, and then something happened in the moment that just brought that up, or the frustration or the hurt or whatever the feeling is from the past comes up. So good to notice that, but we can only notice it in the present moment, and that's what you're talking about, that stop mess method, where you pause for a moment and gather those thoughts together. Where does this come from? You know, I mean, if somebody cuts you off in traffic or you know if something not good happens, a family member gets sick or something, you know that's something we have to deal with and it may not be a pain from the past, but something that is happening. But until we take that moment to pause and consciously think of it, we're going to be in reaction mode.

Debbie:

The same thing with the future. If we're just freaking out about what might happen, we are literally wasting our time. We are flooding our bodies with negative stress hormones that are actually doing damage to us and we're not good for anything. We've actually shut off our reasoning, our reasonable thought patterns. So when we're experiencing that, can we say I am just so stressed, I'm freaking out right now. Can I take a moment and breathe the in the out and really think about what's going on? That was the stress less plan more. And maybe I need a different phrase. What did I say before? Less stress, more success. Oh no, I like that. Maybe that's a better one, because we we want to be successful and we can be successful, but not if we're just constantly in the past or constantly in the present I mean in the future upset about things that we can't do anything about.

Deborah:

So you know, that was perfect, the stop method and you know and I have I'm a member of the board of an organization called Be Present, and Lily Allen, who is the founder of this organization, says so many times, and I repeat it so many times you know, the present is in the present right.

Deborah:

The only thing that you can affect is what's going on right now. And if you're able to connect to that and right now we're talking about self-love I made it to this present moment. I've made it to this next present moment. I've made it to this next present moment. I'm making it to the next present moment. So, then, you're building in your life a habit of success, a habit of gratitude, a habit of knowing that you're able to sustain yourself in the present moment successfully, and what that does is it informs you that, whatever happens in the future, you're going to more likely than not be successful in dealing with whatever that is, and so keeping yourself in the present moment allows you to feel that success that will come as new things arrive, and you're feeding that self-love.

Debbie:

Absolutely.

Deborah:

You're adding to that self-love and you're because of that, you're also more able to implement your self-care practices.

Debbie:

Yeah, I don't even know how to piggyback on that Like uh-huh, yep, yes, I agree.

Deborah:

We don't have to disagree.

Debbie:

No, no, no, I just, you know, I, I can't, I can't make it better, it just it was, it's perfect just like it is. That's exactly what I think has to happen because, um, you know, no matter how we want to be miserable, you know, a lot of us live in a victim energy or a lot of the time, some of the time, part of the time, whatever, we've all made it this far. That's success, right? Some people haven't made it, but if you're listening, you've made it right. You've made it to this moment and then this next moment, in this next moment, and you're going to continue to make it. Somehow, somehow, you're going to figure out a way.

Debbie:

It is how the brain works. It wants to conserve calories I know that that's kind of whatever but it also wants to survive, and we do. We've learned how to survive, we will survive, and in that surviving which is not fun we've learned a lot, and it's a matter of paying attention to what have I learned and how am I going to learn more from it. So, when something not so great happens, what am I learning and how can I improve me? Because that's the only person we can improve. How can I improve myself? With better self-care, more self-love or do something a little bit different so I get a better reaction or response next time.

Deborah:

I hate to say reaction, but yeah, and the other thing, that is a mission, my mission, one of the missions that I have in life, is by loving ourselves and having that level of self-awareness. It creates space for us to be more compassionate, more loving for others in the world. I think if you're spending all of your time being anxious about the future and being anxious about the past and not feeling safe, feeling anxiety in just this very moment, then it's hard for you to think about anybody else's pain or anybody else's existence. You know, when I thought about all it is so funny and I don't want to talk about, maybe necessarily the political, you know thing that we're looking at, but it was so funny because I was going oh, these people are going to be affected, and these people are going to be affected and these people are going to be affected. It's going to be horrible and you know.

Deborah:

But first of all, I let myself feel those feelings. I had the opportunity to feel those feelings and I totally forgot how it was going to be different for me, because I'm like, oh, I'm Black and I'm a woman. There's going to be some things happening here that's going to affect me, but my point is that I was able to, um contribute to the well-being of society by thinking outside of myself, being able to hold space for people other than myself, because, when it comes right down to it, I'd rather live in a world where we are aware and want to take care of ourselves, not at the expense of other people where the power of love overshadows the love of power yeah, I mean, I love that yeah, I, uh, I've been thinking about what can we do?

Debbie:

how can we, you know, make things like this happen? And I, um, I, I mean communities need to be formed. I would like to offer to people that are isolated right now and feel very individual and they're not part of groups, that to get part of something, even if it's a craft club, a book club, an art community, if it doesn't have to be a political whatever. But if you're feeling down, if you're feeling sad, if you're feeling alone, feeling down, if you're feeling sad, if you're feeling alone, feeling isolated, one way that you can help yourself is by finding people of like mind and participating with them. I'm not on TikTok. I will go on YouTube and I, but I will see people will post TikTok things on YouTube and I've seen something called the fourB movement. Have you seen that?

Deborah:

No.

Debbie:

So apparently in South Korea there's four words that start with the letter B. The way they're translated into English is these women are not having sex, they're not dating, they're not getting married and they're not having babies, and whatever the however they say that in Korean, they all start with the letter B. That has come over here now on TikTok and there's a lot of very frustrated people that are taking action and they're finding their communities to take action in. It's more political, and so if somebody is interested in that, they can certainly do that. But not everybody is an activist. Not everybody wants to put themselves out there, wants to put themselves out there.

Debbie:

But I think there's many of us and I say us, those that are listening to this type of podcast that feel slighted, feel like something went wrong, feel like there's a lot of fear. I, how's my life going to work out? And I'm not saying don't have those feelings, but I am also saying like, be consciously aware of what those are and where they're coming from. And, of course, if you need to talk to somebody you know, you call either Deborah or I, get in contact with us. You can also join some kind of a group and have some camaraderie somewhere, because that's making connection, and connection is super important right now.

Deborah:

Mm-hmm and support and one of the things when you were talking, debbie, I mean I just love what you said, but it is not sunshine and unicorns in anybody's life. Every day, all day, whatever, no matter what your practices are, I love myself to death. I think I'm fabulous. I have great self care practices I do but I give myself permission, or permission to feel my feels. If I'm upset, if I'm you know, I have some concerns, or if I'm fearful, or whatever my thing is, you just don't stay there. It's like, okay, I'm gonna grieve. You know, this is not what I expected. This is not what I had hoped for. I have some disappointment in this moment, but now I am going to support myself in moving through that and then I'm going to come back to the present to see what it is for me to do in this moment and the thoughts and whatever you're just choosing.

Debbie:

You may do on the individual basis, but you and I have had conversation about it. You've talked with Patrick, you've talked with other friends, so you could. You've been in community with people as well, so that you have not felt alone the same with me you know having. So, yeah, we're just encouraging because your wellness practice is different from my wellness practice.

Deborah:

Right.

Debbie:

And we all do things differently. So don't try to feel like you have to do things in the way that somebody else does them, but allow yourself to feel what you're feeling. Love yourself, put your arms around yourself. I've let myself cry because I needed to cry. I needed to let it out, and it was okay I did.

Debbie:

I was sad for a bit and then I was like, okay, it's not that I won't be sad again or I can't be sad now, or whatever, but it's like I don't want to live in the space of sad. I can't do anything with sad. I want to live in the space of possibility. What comes next? Where's the hope? What, where? What am I able to do?

Debbie:

And when I say hope, I don't mean, like you said, rainbows and unicorns. I know it's going to get bad. It's going to get bad. And how am I preparing myself to know that I'm going to get bad? It's going to get bad. And how am I preparing myself to know that I'm going to be okay? And I know that I'm going to be okay Somehow, some way, some way, whatever. I know I'll be okay. I might be miserable, might be uncomfortable, but I'll still be okay.

Debbie:

Right, it's how to not allow the feeling of being a victim, because that came up really strongly for me. It's like I've been fighting my whole life against this kind of thing and now it's gone totally backwards, you know, and I just went through that whole thing because I am a survivor of sexual abuse, so a lot of that came up for me, came up for me and so, uh, but being able to like having all this, these skills, and being able to find within myself where I need to go internally to be okay, um, find my clarity, etc. Uh has made all the difference in the world.

Deborah:

Um, so highly encouraging people to yeah, yeah, and I love, just like what you say. And if your current community isn't supporting you, isn't serving you, have the courage to step out and find one. That is, I think, a lot of us. I've had to do this several times in my life. You know where I've been in a community. I've been entrenched in a community, you know, and it wasn't serving me, I wasn't thriving, I wasn't enjoying it even. I mean there was some benefit because we had fun, but I had to find the courage to step out and reach out to other communities or to other people that were more aligned with what I believe supports my self-care, my everyday existence.

Debbie:

You just made me realize and I hope this doesn't come off like being arrogant or a smart aleck but the less I knew myself, the less I knew myself, it seemed like, the more I was willing to people please, to try to fit in, to try to connect, to do whatever I thought that I needed to do in order for them to accept me. And it was hard to leave because I was looking for a validation, right. But now I'm, it's pretty easy for me to say thank you, I hope you guys enjoy yourself, but this isn't working for me and to be able to step away from it without worrying oh my gosh, did I hurt their feelings? The thing is a day from now, 24 hours. They're not even going to remember who I am you know what I mean.

Debbie:

They're going to be on to something else. But again, it's about how am I taking care of myself? How am I making sure that the group that I'm with is supportive of me? They are, you know, something that's going to be beneficial, not just to have fun or whatever, although that's fine too, but there's some other heart connection that's going to matter and make a difference.

Deborah:

So so we've kind of come full circle with this conversation.

Debbie:

What a surprise. Never done that before. All right, well, as we like to remind you, guys, we thank you for the loves, the likes, the comments. They're very special and precious to us. We will respond to them, so feel free to continue to do that.

Deborah:

And, as always, we invite you to love and care for the shero in you. Bye.

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Debbie Pearson

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